After 9/24 Shows Conversation

Tiffany Watson (Dancer): You are able to make decision based on and have an artistic choice and get involved – there’s something really beneficial about being on the side that you don’t get when you are right in the center.

John Cooper: You explained that perfectly. In a way it’s that forgivable frustration from the performance. It’s not so much about following a script. It’s about having a social awareness where you can respond to the individual, and that’s what stems from the performance.

Noemie Lafrance: That’s beginning to happen, but it’s still a challenge. It’s another thing we have to break, because if the dancers become so into the roles of audience members and retreat into the walls then that middle space becomes where the open performance space I want to avoid that and have the space feel balanced. I get worried when the space opens up like that. I think the performers have to strategize where they make their decisions – If you go and lie down in that open space then you are conforming to the fact that that is the performance space, but that’s a problem because you should be working on erasing that space and making it disappear.

JC: Normally the performance space is defined by walls, but now you are creating a performance space defined by lines of sight. The ring that is formed creates the sheer desire to see and then moves people into these clear shapes.

NL: We could use that more – last week when she was moving in the corner because they were waiting and she was doing it so long, but it was just a simple butt movement and it’s a funny thing that everyone is a heard going over there, but it didn’t work this time, the audience was forming a ring and it was clear they wanted to establish – that’s their power – is to establish the performance space in the middle.

David Sutcliffe (Dancer): Do you think that when the performance becomes more polished and people start knowing the cues better that it’ll become quicker and create that anticipation?

NL: Certain things are moving too fast, because we are getting the jist of it and moving through things. He knew the show, because he had been there, but it’s so different now. That being so, would you be able to know what was going to happen?

JC: No, I had no idea. Well, perhaps, I recognized some forms, but I didn’t know how they would transform.

NL: But interpreted differently those forms are just something else.

JC: I suppose, in my perspective, because I saw it last time, the reason I didn’t participate besides of just doing something on my own is because I have this position to think about what is going on and what’s happening, and knowing that my part of the performance is participating in the conversation after where I feel more comfortable participating – or do I give that position up to experience a more qualitative or organic movement, or conformity or non-conformity, and my thought was no - I value the position that I took as an outsider, as a witness, to me more enjoyable – it’s not contrary, because that’s one thing this performance furnished me with - This is what I mean about conformity and non-conformity, because it sounds a bit like if you don’t conform then you’re being rude or arrogant.

Tiffany Watson (dancer) I think you don’t realize that you’re contribution and what you were doing and your choices. You were making a contribution that was valuable. She noticed you and actually thought you were a part of the piece.

A: Yeah, I thought he was the anchor because he reminded me of the part with the TV, the guy talking about the TV - he had an Ipad a lot, not during, but felt like he was a counterpart or the anchor of the performance.

TW (D): But it is because people are actually looking everywhere. You’re not just looking at the center what I understand is that it shouldn’t . The audience becomes part of the show. It shouldn’t be that the audience is on the outside and the performance is in the center. It’s not only in one form, but spread out and infused.

NL: I am tempted to do a square around sooner because it gets people off the safety zone, wall – it’s the farthest you can retreat to and maybe it’s because I’m the creator – I’m always antsy about the people on the wall, get out of it. And maybe that doesn’t help or change the piece in a positive way.
I like the moment we had in another version where they are combing the audience. As an audience member you are not doing anything, but you are being subject to and that is a subtle line of participation And I can’t recreate it because now everyone is following us everywhere and if I do it too early, then I reveal the dancers which ruins the rest of the experience. It’s tricky because certain elements are good in some performances and not in others. I would the dancers eliminate the creation of the performance space as soon as it is created, but it’s hard because dancers can’t fill it because it’s obvious that it is the dancers again.

DS (D): One of the moments I feel worked well was the ‘left, right, left’ moments. It feels like the space becomes more scattered with bodies dispersed more evenly. It seems there is a communal direction, but I don’t think you want to build to that too quickly.

NL: I thought ‘left right left’ worked better last week, Last week more people did it and it felt like it was the whole room. And I don’t know if we are starting it too early or not waiting long enough, but there were definitely some people looking at me and wondering if they should move.

TW (D): I don’t know either, As a dancer we keep hearing different feedback – some people were nervous and now we don’t know what to think. I had a different approach to it this week, it felt different.

NL: Things we tried to repeat from last week to this week got stale. Last week there was a lot of stress on that you have to be totally incognito. No one can know that you are a performer. It worked and was spooky. No one knew except five people and things kept happening and it was so impossible to tell. very interesting tension, but now it feels like it came back because of the invitation and it became imbalanced. The separation that happened when we were screaming, I think that wasn’t working

A: It was a great moment because it was annoying and then you really wanted to do it. Not because you were asked, but because you really wanted to scream. As an audience member you wanted to participate, and figured well they’re going to ask me anyway. Then after it turned into a hum, and was so hard to tell where it was coming from because of the acoustics of the room.

NL: Last week there wasn’t the divide between the up and the down. So it was a big group. There were too many down, and all the down have to move – in order for it to really work everyone has to move. If you can manage to get all the down on one side, then you have a larger impact of the two groups that are formed. Also, I think the dancers were getting too excited about participating again.

A: The audience was also becoming too excited – there were many audience members that were not touched that went down. Everyone was cooperating by then.

NL: Even in the beginning with the puzzle, it’s only supposed to be three dancers and then all the dancers began to do it, and became obvious. We had only 3 and to do until the audience and it’s very different when it happens that way.

Zoe Scheiber (Dancer): The space felt larger. I know I joined in because everyone in that part was over there and I wanted to draw attention to my area and spread it out.

NL: We need to close that space and bring everyone’s attention elsewhere. We don’t want to fill that space, we want to say no that is not the performance space – You are the performance. By agreeing to that circle we are agreeing to the audience. It’s a power play, by saying we will perform in the hole you made then they get the power and we are forced to perform instead of them performing because we are following what they did and the more that happens the more the space is being created – but if we deny it and perform elsewhere then we close the space, they participate and we gain the power back.

ZS (D): Then you also bring back that curiosity and attention.

TW (D): I think a couple people joined in readily as though you couldn’t tell that she wasn’t a performer. I wonder how you could play with that and use it.

NL: An audience member who wasn’t a dancer lied down and looked a lot like a performer. The people that stand out are so important.

JC (D): Depending on how you structure it. You can frame the participation, If you act on your own will then you’re crazy and equally you can play it if you approach it with aggression then you have the capacity to avert all these feelings of infantile desires and feelings of shame and need. The other way is dependant on which performer approached me – it could be determined by what they say and how they greet me. If someone says, would you be so kind as to join me? If not, you are being incredibly rude.

NL: That’s a nice way of manipulating the ones who are standing back. Different people Some will participate for the experience, or some are crazy and over participate, but some participate just to be polite. Then there are exhibitions who will take advantage of the opportunity and be excited.

Tatyana Okshteyn (Black & White Gallery): In the beginning I didn’t want to do the movements and I was running away, but then I was drawn in. Especially the ‘right, left, right’ portion because there was another audience member that pulled me in. He was very natural and not professional. It was less intimidating to work with an audience member rather then doing it beside a professional.

NL: That one day, when you started to do the right left right, there were a lot of people.

TO: For me rhythm is very important, but if I don’t get it then I really pull back until I find it. I want to follow what I’m hearing, but at one point I decided to say forget it.

NL: It’s funny because the dancers are saying ‘right left right’ but it’s actually not the correct feet.

TO: Yes, the text is funny and for me that is the best part of the programming. It’s a nice balance because it’s deceivingly not singing and using the voice, and for me that is totally new and done very well. I like artists using text in their art and adding another layer to the work.

NL: It’s nice to see the audience be engaged and saying things.

TO: I felt like the sound quality is something to be aware of. It changes the performance. The sounds called cold-poetry from 20s-30s, and they used text in their work. This for me, was the most interesting part as a new addition

NL: They use text a lot in dance and dance theater, but it’s not normally used as music – I’m trying to use it as music. Sometimes they use poetry and text incorporated in the music, and many other things.

TO: So, do you feel that everyday is different?

NL: Yes, every week is different, but I preferred was last weekend.

TO: This weekend is much calmer. There are some subtle things are different and it’s a different piece.

NL: Last week was mysterious. This was enthusiastic. 4:30 was almost childish, but I felt like the 5:30 show last week was sophisticated. She said someone from the audience taught her.

TO: I was intimidated from following the dancers and thought I wouldn’t get it, but I decided to follow him.

NL: The whole room did the movements – everyone. The voice and movement were all there. Everyone was smiling inside saying they were doing it. Now, because people know the dancers a little bit more – when you don’t know who is who then choreography can be taught by the audience to other audience members. This time the dancers were more forward and inviting.

JC: It’s great to come back. It’s an amazing thing to come and see a performance twice and have a different experience every time. It’s a bit more complicated tonight.

NL: It is more complicated because I’ve been giving it a lot of thought. My goal tonight was to make the experience more complex for the audience members. We tried more basic things to make people participate. Can we create these two groups and have them participate with each other? Then, we worked past that to make three groups and make the end choreography orchestrated? How can the level of complexity grow so that the audience can do it?